The God Debate v3

[Berserker]

What the bunnies is this

 

[roygator14]

I will agree with Jimmer here.
I believe in God.
The one stated in the Christian Bible.

Basically, Faith is something you cannot see, feel, or touch.
No one on either side of this argument will ever win.
Christians will not be able to prove the existence of God to anyone. Everyone including God could admit this. It cannot physically be proven.

Atheists, You cannot prove to anyone that Evolution happened. You cannot prove that a God didn't create the Universe.

There really is no point to this thread.
No one can win the argument, as the only proof is given when you die.

While your alive.
You can believe in God, and have faith.
Or you cannot.
Ironically enough, Atheists state that they don't want to believe in something they cannot see.
But they didn't see the creation of the Universe either.
They didn't see the start of life on Earth..

Your choice.

 

[Evermore]

"Acknowledge me as God or face eternal suffering!"

Thanks God, loving the free will you graciously provide...

 

[roygator14]

"Acknowledge me as God or face eternal suffering!"

Thanks God, loving the free will you graciously provide...

I really wonder sometimes.
Why do Atheists tend to mainly defend themselves and state the Christians are always wrong?
Is it because they feel threatened by Christians?
Is it because they know we have the stronger point, as they are the hypocrites stating they don't want to believe in something they cannot see?
Is it because they know we are right, an don't want to admit it?

Hmm...

 

[Evermore]

I really wonder sometimes.
Why do Atheists tend to mainly defend themselves and state the Christians are always wrong?
Is it because they feel threatened by Christians?
Is it because they know we have the stronger point, as they are the hypocrites stating they don't want to believe in something they cannot see?
Is it because they know we are right, an don't want to admit it?

Hmm...

This post is simply a giant ad hominem and is intrinsically hypocritical, for obvious reasons; everything you said could also apply to you and your standpoint. You did not even attempt to give a rebuttal to my point.

Your ignorance is truly astonishing. You assume that I am atheist, as if the only two choices in this matter is atheism or Christianity, ignoring the thousands of other religions practiced throughout the world. As an agnostic, it is people like you that make me want to disbelieve in god, as I couldn't possibly associate myself with a person so close-minded.

 

[FjRI || Catty]

The bible is a contradiction. Science has proved too much. There's your answer really.

 

[Mooclan]

I have my opinions, but I'll keep them to myself. Suffice it to say that I believe in God, the Christian one. I won't go into further detail, cause I don't want to pull a Mooclan or a Tenebrous12321

<3

thanks for tagging me and making me aware of an on-going debate ;]

What the bunnies is this

rabbits*

Atheists, You cannot prove to anyone that Evolution happened. You cannot prove that a God didn't create the Universe.

mm that's up for debate. your arguments are meh. and by meh, i mean really meh.

"Acknowledge me as God or face eternal suffering!"

Thanks God, loving the free will you graciously provide...

its a lot more complicated than that - simplifying it like that to further a point doesn't help in a situation like this. it's basically trying to inject wit, but in a way that is distracting and (it could be argued) negative to the discussion.

I really wonder sometimes.
Why do Atheists tend to mainly defend themselves and state the Christians are always wrong?
Is it because they feel threatened by Christians?
Is it because they know we have the stronger point, as they are the hypocrites stating they don't want to believe in something they cannot see?
Is it because they know we are right, an don't want to admit it?

nope.
good for you for trying to at least raise questions, but they're questions without proper foundations.

Your ignorance is truly astonishing. You assume that I am atheist, as if the only two choices in this matter is atheism or Christianity, ignoring the thousands of other religions practiced throughout the world. As an agnostic, it is people like you that make me want to disbelieve in god, as I couldn't possibly associate myself with a person so close-minded.

sorry Evermore, but you went too far by saying:

Your ignorance is truly astonishing.

and

people like you that make me want to disbelieve in god, as I couldn't possibly associate myself with a person so close-minded.

that's not helping, it's just being a rude dude.

The bible is a contradiction. Science has proved too much. There's your answer really.

okay sorry but no - you can't just say that. "There's your answer", but nothing to back it up. And you can't automatically assume that everyone has previous knowledge of the evidence that you're trying to (vaguely) refer to, because.. not everyone has! (that is, if there is indisputable in the first place.)


I'm not arguing for either of these sides at the moment - I've done it before, though. I, myself, am a Christian. I'm just here to check for invalid arguments. ;]

-snip-

Isn't it a bit harsh to pick on Roygator? XD The poor guy...

 

[Tenebrous]

<3

thanks for tagging me and making me aware of an on-going debate ;]


rabbits*

mm that's up for debate. your arguments are meh. and by meh, i mean really meh.

its a lot more complicated than that - simplifying it like that to further a point doesn't help in a situation like this. it's basically trying to inject wit, but in a way that is distracting and (it could be argued) negative to the discussion.


nope.
good for you for trying to at least raise questions, but they're questions without proper foundations.


sorry Evermore, but you went too far by saying:

and


that's not helping, it's just being a rude dude.


okay sorry but no - you can't just say that. "There's your answer", but nothing to back it up. And you can't automatically assume that everyone has previous knowledge of the evidence that you're trying to (vaguely) refer to, because.. not everyone has! (that is, if there is indisputable in the first place.)


I'm not arguing for either of these sides at the moment - I've done it before, though. I, myself, am a Christian. I'm just here to check for invalid arguments. ;]

Isn't it a bit harsh to pick on Roygator? XD The poor guy...

Hey Mooclan!
Yeah I've decided not to continue replying to him as he seems to just be spewing bad attempts at apologetics.
Anyway. I'm much more well versed on this topic than last time. (I did research on Tactitus, Josephus, etc). And it'd be pretty interesting if we continued the debate we had going.

Thanks! You're a cool guy!

 

[Tenebrous]

Mooclan
Some conversation starters if you are in the mood for this rn.

Problem of evil

Free will

Morality / Euthyphro's Dilemma

Pascal's Wager

Problem of Hell

Why there is no evidence of God

Historicity of Jesus Christ/Reliability of the NT

Theistic Evolution

Evolutionary argument against naturalism

Darwinian Problem of Evil

Ontological Argument

Cosmological Argument

Fine Tuning

Creationism (if an old earth can fit with a Christian world view).

Omnipotence Paradox

 

[feminist]

Why do Atheists tend to mainly defend themselves and state the Christians are always wrong?

Because they have a different viewpoint to you.

Is it because they feel threatened by Christians?

I'm very scared of you preaching I'll go to hell if I don't believe in your god.

Is it because they know we have the stronger point, as they are the hypocrites stating they don't want to believe in something they cannot see?

Give me proof, any proof that gives existence of god. For points and evidence you need proof, from what I can see you haven't supplied any proof.

Is it because they know we are right, an don't want to admit it?

Neither side knows if they are right as there is no solid proof for either side of the debate.

No one is scared of you or feels threatened by you, keep making up those cute excuses so you don't need to actually use logic in an argument. People like you make me sick. Being a Christian is fine, many of their morals and values are great but holy Good, maybe if you pray hard enough your god can solve world hunger, poverty and hey even kill ISIS while he's at it, sending down some unicorns would be cool too.

I'm also agnostic, I don't believe or disbelieve.

 

[Mooclan]

Mooclan
Some conversation starters if you are in the mood for this rn.

oh, gosh... XD

let's see if i can make one-sentence answers/responses/remarks/comments, just for the heck of it - don't expect any grandiose answers and fantastic reasoning/evidence.

Problem of evil

Free will

I feel like these two are linked in some ways: We are given free will, partially by the "apple" that Adam/Eve ate (whether literally or metaphorically), and partially by the way that we were created.

Morality / Euthyphro's Dilemma

Don't know what that second one is, but morality is the sense of what is right and wrong. Christians (generally) argue that it was put in place, just like previous mentioned, by the way that we were created and also by the fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. (is that the proper name? can't remember)

Pascal's Wager

don't know what it is, but i'll take a quick google search
oh
well, it also makes the world a better place by most modern-day standards I think we can all agree, to some extent, on that one.

Problem of Hell

From what I remember being taught within the past year at a theological convention for high school students (it's a miracle i stayed awake for even a quarter of the classes and yet remember half of the material taught), "Hell" as we know it was originally created as a final place for the fallen angels/demons, and oh-so-conveniently (which is to say, not at all conveniently for us) fits the "bad people", to put it lightly.

Why there is no evidence of God

Well, here's an interesting story...

Last weekend, I went snowboarding for the first time in 6 years. Naturally, I fell a few times here and there, but I was surprisingly better than a dude my same age who snowboards more frequently than I do.
At the bottom of a hill, where various snowboard/ski runs "merged", the snow was considerably more packed than in other areas - I let myself take a fall, but because the snow was so packed, it was nearly as bad as landing on concrete. I landed on my rear-end and the palms of my hands, and I sprained my wrist something awful. I kept on snowboarding, but even the slightest motion in my (right) wrist would agitate it and cause pain. Luckily, I've always had a high pain tolerance.

Later that day, because I was at the ski resort for a church Youth Retreat (a friend invited me), we were having a group prayer. In my own prayers, being a Christian myself, I included my wrist. I anticipated a prayer, and so I experimented with my wrist before the prayer, and I found that my wrist was still in very noticeable amounts of pain from moving it, even if it was a normal movement. The prayer lasted a solid 7-10 minutes, because we went around in the circle of 17 people, and during the prayer I didn't allow myself to touch or move my wrist beyond normal readjustments for comfort. Immediately once the prayer ended, I rotated my wrist fully and even pressed in various parts of it, and there was absolutely no pain, in less than a 10-minute gap.

That was last weekend, on Saturday night - it's now Thursday night, and my wrist is still totally fine. No pain, no agitation, nothing.

Sorry, but that's a bit hard to explain normally I'd be fascinated to hear an explanation that you might be able to come up with - it's quite possible that I overlooked/missed some entirely logical explanation.

Historicity of Jesus Christ/Reliability of the NT

I'm not totally sure where I would start with the historicity, but the reliability of the NT is something that I'd have to be much more advanced in my learning to discuss to a degree that is deserving of that topic. I clearly recall hearing several strong arguments, and thinking something along the lines of "This is logical and makes sense," but I can't remember what those exact arguments are. I'm a bad student

Theistic Evolution

I remember having several moments where I was thinking about this, and I recall that I had one particular explanation that was slightly different from the more common ones, but made more sense and fit quite snugly with much of the scientific evidence that we have that is taught in schools.

Sadly, I can't remember it at the moment. It had something to do with interpreting the diction in the book of Genesis in a way other than literally, which is something that so many people are hesitant to do.


I still have homework to do, sadly, so I don't think I should spend more time going over the rest of the list. Sorry! D:

Give me proof, any proof that gives existence of god. For points and evidence you need proof, from what I can see you haven't supplied any proof.

read my super-long testimony, above.

Because they have a different viewpoint to you.

not quite, actually

I'm very scared of you preaching I'll go to hell if I don't believe in your god.

sarcasm is called the lowest form of wit, but it's still good for chuckles once in a while.

sadly, this wasn't.

Neither side knows if they are right as there is no solid proof for either side of the debate.

mm, depends on how you define "knows" and "solid proof"

Technicalities, brev, technicalities. They're a tuffie.

cute

that was a bad usage of the word cute..

People like you make me sick

Keep that to yourself, tbh. If you want to be rude about it, don't go and be rude to people who can't defend themselves. (sorry roygator, but i'm not sure if you're ready for this thread yet. but thanks for trying!! <3 ur a cool kat [or gator])

like, go to a trump rally or something LMAO i'm sure you'd find plenty of sympathizers

please re-read the rules
http://www.mcgamer.net/threads/mcgamer-updated-rules-version-3-0.12254/
it really feels like your brain forgot them - i won't make any personal remarks about the capacity of your brain, but I strongly recommend surgery (when that becomes a realistic possibility) to improve it's functions.

sending down some unicorns would be cool too.

honestly i would like that too, if they were as childhood stories lead us to believe.

if they went around on blind rampages (like some people on the forums these days....), then I don't think I would like that as much. Unless I was leading them in a rebellion. that'd be hella fun.

 

[FjRI || Catty]

okay sorry but no - you can't just say that. "There's your answer", but nothing to back it up. And you can't automatically assume that everyone has previous knowledge of the evidence that you're trying to (vaguely) refer to, because.. not everyone has! (that is, if there is indisputable in the first place.)

Alrighty, I'll clarify for you then.
Science has suggested other, and (in my opinion), more sensible theories as to how the Earth was created. Growing up as a former Catholic, I learnt that there are many different types of Christians, along with the different branches of Christianity itself (hence my understanding that not all Christians believe in Adam and Eve). However, this seems like the prime example of a contradiction. Yes, I am aware that Christians do not agree with all the beliefs outlined in the Old Testament, but why? If the bible is such a sacred text, why not accept it as a whole? If the bible is so special, why did God himself not write it? Why do the Jewish and the Christians experience such contrast in religious beliefs if they believe in literally the same God.
My mother always told me to pray for things and not to sin because I would be punished. However, why is there punishment if the Christian God is presumed to be ever-loving and forgiving? Not to mention the fact that all my prayers, genuine and compassionate as I believed they were, I felt never really did anything.
One final thing would like to add is the fact that a majority of Christians (almost every Christian I myself have spoken to) seem to look down on atheism. Time and time again I have heard phrases like "Oh you're not a Christian, so you're a satanist?" and "I've never met a happy atheist." I hate how so many agonists and atheists have to automatically be associated with pessimism and rudeness and failure. Like, no dude, I see the world around me for what I think it is- not how an ancient book tells me.
However, many aspects of the bible do show good messages, e.g. Being kind to your neighbours, having respect. But, as a person who generally disagrees with religious standpoints, I find it makes more sense just to be nice because that's how we feel- not because a supreme power tells us to be.
As a final note- I would like to express the fact that we are all as insignificant as each other. Nobody's opinions are necessarily right when it comes to this debate but I can say that I believe we are just people, evolved animals if you will. Why do people 'thrive' with the belief that we are somehow more than this?
*note: it's 9:14 pm and I'm tired, I'll fix this tomorrow if I remember